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[Conscript] Conscription of US cit for ROC military service

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Conscription of US citizen for ROC military service

Postby JGeer » 02 Jul 2002, 07:26

So our brainwash specialists are employing very effective methods of indoctrination for weakening their wills and for gaining converts like you?

Every time you don't agree with us, you'll hear that lovely song ringing in your ears. [img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

Conscription of US citizen for ROC military service

Postby Lord Lucan » 03 Jul 2002, 22:06

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, Geneva">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by sandman:
<strong>five hours and 15 minutes during a trip to Mull.

I am sure the five hour trip to Mull was worth it. I would imagine Mull of Kintyre was not sung at all either during the trip for hours on end. God how I have learnt to hate that song. "Mists rolling in" "Sea of desire" I'll give you mist you annoying little scouse
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Conscription of US citizen for ROC military service

Postby BAH » 04 Jul 2002, 13:25


An interesting idea. I am a dual citizen of conscription age, but I will decline the offer to volunteer to be drafted.

I had a professor (American of German descent) who, while studying in Taiwan during the 70s, was drafted. He wasn't a dual citizen or anything. He dutifully showed up after receiving the draft notice, but was immediately told to go home.
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Conscription of US citizen for ROC military service

Postby JGeer » 04 Jul 2002, 23:29

Back then, such a case was certainly an exception to the norm. Today, those numbers are bigger and proper measures must be established.

Conscription of US citizen for ROC military service

Postby Poagao » 05 Jul 2002, 02:17

That case, of an American of German decent studying in Taiwan being "drafted", was almost certainly an administrative error. I doubt there are that many more such cases these days than there were then, i.e. an administrative error causing an incorrect draft notice to be issued.
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Conscription of US citizen for ROC military service

Postby JGeer » 06 Jul 2002, 00:56

The pool of permanent residents and dual citizens is probably far larger today than 25 years ago. In Taiwan there are about 5,000 US citizens with ARC and there are perhaps as many as 50,000 US-ROC dual citizens.

Conscription of US citizen for ROC military service

Postby aceman » 21 Jul 2002, 11:28

I don't get whats the big long as you leave every 4 months, couldn't a dual citizen get off of the draft?
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Conscription of US citizen for ROC military service

Postby JGeer » 27 Jul 2002, 04:19

No. It is a changing policy, and there are other dual nationality issues like a 1946 Treaty for US citizens in the ROC. The ROC conscription system is broken for many reasons including Laws of War. What is the exact POW status of dual US citizens in the ROC military?

To the PLA, all ROC soldiers are just rebels of their internal affairs, and they will not likely even recognize their standing as POWs like the USA does for "rebels" on Taiwan under the Geneva Conventions. The situation for US citizens is sticky because of the ICC and the more or less controversial terrorist "detainee status" in lieu of the POW status. For West Berlin, there was no question of US citizens possibly under the Geneva Convention.

What a tough issue!

Postby DevilDuke » 18 Aug 2002, 18:45

All I can say is this is a really messy issue, therefore I'm going to relate to this but make a separate point. I think there's a point needed to be made here where Taiwanese and Non-Taiwanese interested in the issue forget the whys and hows. First why? Why does Taiwan need conscription? Well even if Taiwan wasn't ruled by the KMT, there still would be conscription because the main and probably only enemy Taiwan has is China and compare the full/part time military of 6 million to 100 million. Taiwanese citizens are also not known to be fanatics of nationlistic pride, therefore without conscription there wouldn't even be a talk today, right here on this board or anywhere about pro-independance. You might as well give up with a fight and recognize yourself as part of the PRC. Which leads to another issue I might state:

Imigration out of Taiwan, certainly if Taiwan indeed went through a process of initiation into officially becoming part of the PRC, or uniting, many, mainly rich and middle-class would immigrate out of the country to predominantly U.S. and Canada. Taiwanese-Americans and Chinese-Americans do have a difference, the main being almost all if not all Taiwanese-Americans have went back and visited "home".

The second issue is "how", look face it, your fortunate enough to be born in a democratic society as if you were in China and lashing out at the country for drafting you, after you've dodged to another, they'd execute you for that. The how here is how to set up a non-draft system in which male and female would seek the military as a profession out of own will and only approve a draft in the situation of war. The answer if not likely, but only possible if Taiwan has full international recognition and support of being a independant COUNTRY.

Postby Eric W. Lier » 14 Jul 2003, 20:03

If an US court finds against Taiwan in the proposed suit, what would be the remedies available to the plaintiff and how would they be enforced ?

Here is one possible remedy. Have the plaintiff volunteer for US military service instead. The US military is the only force willing and capable of defending Taiwan. Serving in the US military as a Taiwanese American is a much more effective way of ensuring the defense of Taiwan. When the war for Taiwan takes place, Chinese speaking people trained in the ways of modern warfare will be an invaluable asset in either army.
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