cfimages wrote:Confuzius wrote:
Oh, ahem...excuse me, I guess I should state "Muslim countries in the Middle East".
Is that better? I thought it was implied. (the fact that the majority of Muslims are of Asian descent rather than Arabic or Persian is just as unrelated to what I said).
Well in that case it could be said that it's a Middle East problem not a Muslim problem. Israel was led by the likes of Ariel Sharon for a number of years who has a lot of blood on his hands from massacres of civilians, and is Netanyahu is the current leader so it appears that the extremists are on both sides of the divide in that region.
Got To Be Kidding wrote:We are dangerously close to having this thread tossed into the International Politics forum.
The question that we are addressing is Islam. CFI brought up a valid point about muslims in south asia and southeast asia being different than the muslims in the middle east.
Which is a good question.
There are fewer terrorists coming from the muslim countries of south asia - although, I stress the word fewer. And there are even fewer terrorists coming from southeast asia.
However, there are terrorists coming from all those countries. Remember the Bali bombings? The bombings in Kashmir?
So, I agree that culture has an impact on how muslims react to the Quran. Also, there are pressures in the Middle East that do not exist to the same degree in southeast Asia.
You can see what happens when you put pressure on various religious groups. Pressure the Jewish community, and they emigrate. Pressure the Christian community, and they do much the same (although some Christian groups do react violently). The same goes for Buddhists, Hindus, Daoists, etc.
Pressure the muslims, and you get terrorism.
And, these pressures happen in many different ways. Resource pressures. Political pressures. All kinds of pressures.
Remember that the reason why we are discussing this, is because we are trying to get to bottom of the argument for why "99% of all muslims might not be terrorists, but 99% of all terrorists are muslim."
Trying to ignore this fact, is a dangerous fantasy.
Confuzius wrote:Still think Islam is in need of a massive reformation.
The Old Testament (as I have stated in this thread already) is way bloodier than the Koran. So what caused the Jews to "wrap their god of war in tephilin" (as an Israeli poet put it)...essentially it was the rabbis of the Talmud.
After the Bar Kochba revolt when the Jewish rebels got their asses handed to them by the Romans, the rabbis made all sorts of efforts to both curtail, and reinterpret a lot of the violent messages in the OT. In classical times Jews were not known as nerdy brainiacs or shrewd businessmen, but a violent warrior people (you read throughout the OT all the time when they encounter a new ethnicity, the ethnicity says something like "We have heard throughout the land that you guys open major cans of woopass on people who stand in your way." But that changed...it was an intentional change that came from within.
Something like this needs to come from within Islam.
Got To Be Kidding wrote:
I agree, I think.
Your remarks are somewhat hard to agree to those of us who adhere to Jewish/Christian principles, but that's your view - so one must give allowances.
Got To Be Kidding wrote:I do not want to debate your view of the bible. Someone else can do that.
Got To Be Kidding wrote:But, you are essentially correct that transformation happened from within - or, from above, as we believers accept it.
Got To Be Kidding wrote:Al lo davar. Ha machshev sh'li lo oseh evrit achshav. Ani diber b'kita gimel, b'regil. Aval, yoter zman chutz l'aretz, yoter ani shoke'ach. Ata yisraeli o mashahu?
Do you WANT to know what the 'xians' think?
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