Does Prayer Work?

[jimipresley]

Interesting to see leaders of the traditionally strongly conservative NG Church in South Africa becoming less dogmatic:

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/ ... e-20110301

I'm reminded of this article from a while back:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 072638.ece

I have no doubt that prayer can be a powerful meditative tool for inner peace and tranquility, hence sometimes a catalyst to self-healing. But praying for others?

What do people think about this? Is the modern theist evolving?

[Chris]

I believe it was Robert G. Ingersoll who said, "Hands that help are far better than lips that pray."

[Got To Be Kidding]

The point about prayer is relationship with the one being prayed to.

[jimipresley]

The point about prayer is relationship with the one being prayed to.

I don't quite get that. Can you expand?

[maoman]

Jp, you totally missed the point of the article. Dude isn't saying prayer doesn't work, he's saying it doesn't work if you treat God as some sort of celestial Santa Claus. Did you not get that from the article?

[jimipresley]

Jp, you totally missed the point of the article. Dude isn't saying prayer doesn't work, he's saying it doesn't work if you treat God as some sort of celestial Santa Claus. Did you not get that from the article?

I think I did get that, maoman. My point is that the idea of what prayer is, seems to be evolving. To most theists, God IS actually a celestial Santa Claus that they turn to in their darkest hours and expect miracles from. SA dominee is saying that there are other forces at work that God has put in place and you should look at prayer as a communion, not a Christmas stocking request sheet.

Perchance my thread title was insensitive. I've changed it. "Prayer doesn't work" is the name of the article that I posted.

[Got To Be Kidding]

Perchance my thread title was insensitive. I've changed it. "Prayer doesn't work" is the name of the article that I posted.

Speaking as one of the theists, I had no problem with your original title. Theists who are easily offended need to spend more time with their holy books.

My point about prayer is also tied in with divea's interesting post, here:

http://forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopic.php?f=121&t=95778

God doesn't need our input into His plans. If someone has gotten far enough into his/her theism to believe that God exists... that God is the Creator... well, it logically follows that God doesn't need our advice.

But, WE need to be making that input. Prayer isn't just about bringing our requests before the Almighty. It's actually more about a process that brings us into line with God's purpose, and our purpose.

And, before anyone thinks that I am dispensing with the need for prayer, think again.

I believe that our whole life should be about having an attitude of prayer.

So, yeah. Prayer works. (At least, it's worked for me.)

[Tempo Gain]

I think Aretha thinks so

[Got To Be Kidding]

I love that song!

But, I've made the mistake of taking a second look at my post, and I can't help myself. I gotta add sumthin'.

Not long after I got married (just three years ago!), my wife told me that she'd started praying for me when she was 17. I ran a quick calculation in my head and realized that her prayers for me coincided with a spectacular crash n burn in my attempt to become a physicist - a truly traumatic experience, I can tell you.

I gotta be careful around the little woman. God listens to her.

[ThreadKiller]

Forgive me for adding my I've stayed away from the R&S forum for a while - and perhaps for a good reason.

Not wanting to insult anyone's interpretation of events in his or her own life, I'd just like to say that of course prayer doesn't work (except as a calming influence for one's self). The fact that no believer can post any empirical evidence for the efficacy of prayer makes this clear. People can only provide testimony, and with so many people praying in the world, coincidences are going to happen. When I believed, I sometimes thought God was opening doors for me. Now that I don't believe, I realize that doors were (and are) opened because I applied myself or because of pure luck.

I know that anyone who believes will tell you: "Faith can't be tested". I agree. And for me it doesn't make sense to believe in something that can't be tested. No decent God would expect that from any of us.