I would like to sue the MOE for failure to follow government laws

[pkelaiditis]

Don't laugh or make snide comments. I'm serious. Instead of continuing to see and hear about endless rule changes and policy interpretations and doing nothing about it to make our lives and minds rest easier, and since the Ministry of Education seems to ignore Council of Labor Affair rulings/directives and/or government laws, and since the MOE seems to do what it pleases with no real consideration of relevant laws/regulations, and despite knowing that, when all is said and done, this is really just a pissing pot contest between the MOE and the CLA, I am willing to spend some time in a court to sue the MOE for negligence/ignorance/whatever can be made to apply to the Ministry, to force it to either recognize relevant laws and how they apply to foreign teachers and/or force the MOE to issue a statement of how and why it applies its policies. Richard, I would be willing to contribute at least 100 000 NTD towards starting the process of filing a suit against the MOE in court here in Taiwan for this purpose, not only to see what will happen, but also as a foreign spouse wanting a final clarification of my work rights/obligations here in Taiwan, because I'm sick of not knowing what I should/shouldn't be doing. After that, if the suit is accepted, I would be willing to go the distance to get an answer one way or the other, as long as the entire process wasn't too expensive. Just send me the relevant information via email, how I need to pay you for your services to file suit in Taipei (or Tainan, where I live and work), and any personal documents I need to prepare and/or send to you to start the ball rolling. I'm willing to do it for everyone's benefit, so please get back to me soon so I know how we can start the process.

[maoman]

You need to talk to Herr Richard Hartzell. He lives for stuff like this!

[amos]

I'd be willing to make a contribution.

[TNT]

I make a contribution too for this

[pkelaiditis]

Thanks, guys. If more people hop on the bandwagon and fund this case, then I'm definitely willing to spend some more of my own time and my own money to be the test case in Taiwan's court system. Having just read that everyone will need licenses in the near future to teach/work in kindergartens, I really think we need some clarification, once and for all, on what is happening with the MOE with regards to their treatment/regulation of the foreign teaching community on a consistent basis. Richard, I await your reply on this matter. If you cannot take up this matter in the courts, just point me to a Taiwanese lawyer who's willing to represent me on this matter, because I think we all need some clarification as soon as possible.

[Hartzell]

Let's get together and talk sometime. I am in the Neihu District of Taipei.

Please be aware that legal action begins with a "rejection" of an application . . . . . so you might want to think of how that is supposed to work . . . . . . in your situation.

We also might try to have some type of coordination meeting with the MOEA, but unless we can get some Legislator or someone to back us up . . . . . that might not work out.

I will be interested to hear details of your situation . . . . . is there any chance you can give me a Chinese language summary???

[daltongang]

you might want to hold it.... I heard today from the taipei buxiban assn. that the MOE has decided to respect the Labor Bureau rules. second hand info but they are reliable. they also said other teachers can obtain 3-year work permits.

[Bu Lai En]

If as Daltongang says, there is change in the wind, maybe it is worth waiting a little.

I'm in the same boat. As I wrote in a thread under the 'Work-related' legal forum, the MOE said I neeeded a work permit from them even though I am married ot a Taiwanese.

But we could establish some sort of fund, and start things happening. Maybe before a test case (eg rejection of Health Insurance card application or MOE forcing my school to make me get a work permit) we could start by collecting infprmation in the form of the written opinions of the CLA and MOE.

Although I don't know much about the Taiwanese structure of government, might the Control Yuan be relevant here. Don't they act as a sort of Ombudsman in some way? If the MOE is ignoring the law, can they force it to obey the law, or make some sort of ruling?

I would also be willing to contribute to some sort of fund, but on a postdated or installment payment plan

Brian

[pkelaiditis]

But we could establish some sort of fund, and start things happening. Maybe before a test case (eg rejection of Health Insurance card application or MOE forcing my school to make me get a work permit) we could start by collecting infprmation in the form of the written opinions of the CLA and MOE.

I don't like the idea of waiting, because we just end up getting more confused, not less, as time passes. My faith in all government laws and regulations related to this situation is seriously eroding as time passes. But, I do like the fund idea. I really want to be the test case. Yes, I am married to a Taiwanese woman, I have the JFRV and personal ARC, and yes, I have the open work permit, but the reason I got that permit apparently changed months ago, making it almost useless (in my semi-educated opinion). So, as of now, I'm working privately, in a buxiban and in an elementary school. In the elementary school I work at, we actually got raided almost a year ago, but when I showed the police officer my permit, he just shrugged and let me go. This makes me think I am legal, but given all of the other rumors, actions, missteps by the MOE, who's to know what is legal or not?

Richard, what are the chances of me/everyone else who is interested paying you for your time/applicable filing fees as they happen out of the aforementioned fund, pulling together relevant information based on our own experiences, and then using either myself or someone else as the test case, whoever has the best chance of winning? I really would like to move forward with this, but living here in Tainan, it may be a little unrealistic for myself being the test case. At any rate, my initial 100 000 NTD contribution stands ready whenever/whoever gets this case off the ground. Better yet, if various people in the foreign community here in Taiwan can work together on different aspects of how poorly foreign workers are treated here in Taiwan (ie. disregard of relevant laws, guarantor stipulations, licenses/contracts which should last a certain period but are in fact linked to your ARC expiration date, etc), and have Richard represent us all in a class action suit against various departments of the government, the money and time spent on such an undertaking may finally get us noticed by the government and treated by its various departments in a positive rather than demeaning manner.

I don't know ... for myself, planning to live and work here until my young daughter finishes high school, I think it may be a worthwhile pursuit just for peace of mind and some form of job security in my own mind. Any one else feel the same way and willing to give it a go? I'd even go as far as helping to pay for an ad in one of the local daily papers to draw some attention to the situation.

[housecat]

I'd be willing to contribute my 2 NT. That's about all I have, but I'd do what I could.