Che Guevara Material

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Che Guevara Material

Postby Ducked » 16 Feb 2012, 10:25

Have a class or two on El Che coming up. Anyone know of any video material (apart from The Motorcycle Diaries, which I can probably get hold of) that might be available?

You'd think there'd be lots of biographical documentaries, but I can't remember seeing any.

(Long time ago I read an account by an American merc pilot who worked for Castro, which gave an interestingly un-flattering picture of Che, though I can't remember title or author. I dunno how objective he was but he seemed very pissed that they "turned out" to be commies. :) )
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Re: Che Guavara Material

Postby StuartCa » 16 Feb 2012, 10:28

There is a really long couple of films that I've seen in Carrefour (not for about a year) and it's simply called Che http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Che_(film).

I wish I'd bought it when I saw it, so if you do find a copy locally I'd like to know.
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Re: Che Guavara Material

Postby ādikarmika » 16 Feb 2012, 10:58

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Re: Che Guavara Material

Postby Ducked » 16 Feb 2012, 11:04

Thanks. Didn't know about that.
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Re: Che Guavara Material

Postby TainanCowboy » 16 Feb 2012, 13:46

Information on the real Ernesto Guevera:

http://www.therealcuba.com/MurderedbyChe.htm

A PDF link to See a list of the documented victims of che Guevara in Cuba, from 1957 to 1959, Compiled by Cuba Archive as of September 30, 2009

from Humberto Fontova, who has written much about the 'fascination' that has surfaced about "Che":

Che Guevara: Assassin and Bumbler – by Humberto Fontova

Che Guevara; Guerrilla Doofus and Murdering Coward

Exposing the Real Che Guevara: And the Useful Idiots Who Idolize Him

From Cuba Tradition . com:

Humberto Fontova

A good video:(youtube)

Che Guevara (Ernesto Guevara de la Serna) - The Real Story

Thia material should provide some of the often missing facts about the Argentine mass murderer who was a useful tool to Fidel Castro.

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Re: Che Guavara Material

Postby finley » 16 Feb 2012, 16:04

Information on the real Ernesto Guevera:

If you read his biography (autobiography? - can't recall) he does come across as a bit of a dick, especially during the years he's trying to stir up some revolutionary fervour in various South American peasants with the help of a ragtag bunch of 'guerrillas' and some worn-out horses. OTOH that's a bloody long book, much of it tedious, so it'd take a while to read. He's one of those characters best described as "complex". Capable of great insight, sympathy and intelligence, while being simultaneously capable of cruelty and general disregard for others (even his friends), utter stupidity and mercurial thoughtlessness, and bumbling incompetence. Certainly a good topic for discussion.
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Re: Che Guavara Material

Postby Ducked » 16 Feb 2012, 16:18

finley wrote:
Information on the real Ernesto Guevera:

If you read his biography (autobiography? - can't recall) he does come across as a bit of a dick, especially during the years he's trying to stir up some revolutionary fervour in various South American peasants with the help of a ragtag bunch of 'guerrillas' and some worn-out horses. OTOH that's a bloody long book, much of it tedious, so it'd take a while to read. He's one of those characters best described as "complex". Capable of great insight, sympathy and intelligence, while being simultaneously capable of cruelty and general disregard for others (even his friends), utter stupidity and mercurial thoughtlessness, and bumbling incompetence. Certainly a good topic for discussion.


Annoyingly, I bought a "coffee table" stylee biography (lots of pictures and not too much text) in a charity shop last summer in Edinburgh, but I was carrying a lot of stuff back and didn't think I'd have further use for it, so I gave it back to the shop once I'd read it. :doh:

Think it might have been this one, though they all have "that" picture so I'm not sure

http://www.dreamlines.ie/products/ENTBK/9780753709009

I remember Africa and Bolivia being described as fairly unimpressive performances (though tough gigs for an asthmatic). Can't remember the mass-murderer aspect being covered much, so they may have glossed or ignored it.

It featured prominently in the US merc's account.
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Re: Che Guevara Material

Postby TheGingerMan » 19 Feb 2012, 23:07

First off, as this thread is still is the forum "Teaching English in Taiwan", I have to ask:
Why a class on Che?
It's an interesting topic, to be sure, but more for the spinoff elements than anything else. Here's a chap whose reputation trickle on down has become a torrent above and beyond anything that he actually achieved in his lifetime.
If that is the topic, well, one would deserve ample audio punishment for even bringing such a subject to a bunch of young punk that know not even a semblance of sentience, or a pound of pain.

Musical interlude following.....




".......Rebellion rushing down the wrong road, storm blowing down the wrong tree......"

~~~~~~

Hitler would have loved Che, as a fellow ruthless confrontational manipulating schemebagger wot realizes the power of a few determined kameraden, and repeating some brand new lie involving a familiar victim to a vacuous populace.

Hardly a fellow mass murderer, though he was apparently adept at rampant elimination.
But so what? He was eliminated himself, due to hubris. Far better that, than if he had succeeded in his self-appointed mission. Thankfully, the Congo experience taught him nothing, he was sought and destroyed.
If only to keep the likes of him from being labelled an intellectual.
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Re: Che Guevara Material

Postby Ducked » 19 Feb 2012, 23:41

TheGingerMan wrote:First off, as this thread is still is the forum "Teaching English in Taiwan", I have to ask:
Why a class on Che?
It's an interesting topic, to be sure, but more for the spinoff elements than anything else. Here's a chap whose reputation trickle on down has become a torrent above and beyond anything that he actually achieved in his lifetime.
If that is the topic, well, one would deserve ample audio punishment for even bringing such a subject to a bunch of young punk that know not even a semblance of sentience, or a pound of pain.



Why not? Don't you answer your own question above?

Other possible answers would be:

(a) Because I say so, and its my class. (b) Because he's in the text book. American English File 3.

From the protestations above methinks it may not be coincidence that its not an American textbook. Perhaps an avoidance of controversy/adherence to the "official" line/suppression of dissent are some of the reasons why they tend to be so anodyne?

It's doubtless true that the topic would be of little interest to Taiwanese yoof, but then, what is?

You can't build a syllabus on "I like play computer." and if all you have to go on as a starting point is the revolutionary chique merchandising, then that's better than nothing.

In fact this is an adult evening class, and I have some hopes they might do something with it, though it'll depend to some extent on how well I set it up, and I've got a lot of other stuff to do.
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Re: Che Guevara Material

Postby Icon » 20 Feb 2012, 09:45

Ducked wrote:
TheGingerMan wrote:First off, as this thread is still is the forum "Teaching English in Taiwan", I have to ask:
Why a class on Che?
It's an interesting topic, to be sure, but more for the spinoff elements than anything else. Here's a chap whose reputation trickle on down has become a torrent above and beyond anything that he actually achieved in his lifetime.
If that is the topic, well, one would deserve ample audio punishment for even bringing such a subject to a bunch of young punk that know not even a semblance of sentience, or a pound of pain.



Why not? Don't you answer your own question above?

Other possible answers would be:

(a) Because I say so, and its my class. (b) Because he's in the text book. American English File 3.

From the protestations above methinks it may not be coincidence that its not an American textbook. Perhaps an avoidance of controversy/adherence to the "official" line/suppression of dissent are some of the reasons why they tend to be so anodyne?

It's doubtless true that the topic would be of little interest to Taiwanese yoof, but then, what is?

You can't build a syllabus on "I like play computer." and if all you have to go on as a starting point is the revolutionary chique merchandising, then that's better than nothing.

In fact this is an adult evening class, and I have some hopes they might do something with it, though it'll depend to some extent on how well I set it up, and I've got a lot of other stuff to do.



I actually like that you are covering this topic because:

1. It shows cultural diversity: OK, maybe not the best role model, but at leats the local students will know there is a bit of a world out there besides US (most textbooks may not even get to George Washington)

2. When they see the Che in T-shirts, in the store at the MRT station, or any other iconic references, they will understand that it is not all plush and cute. Hopefully, they will understand the message behinmd the image. Who knows? Maybe they will have second thoughts about Mao's purses/clocks/mouse pads...

ps.
and for the record, at least back home, even though we have revolutionary heroes, the Che is not considered one of them, most people are very critical of him.
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