Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby smithsgj » 02 Aug 2010, 13:18

ironlady wrote:My readers just use the Hanyu Pinyin (or TOP romanization) on the following page. You can turn back and forth when you need it, but your eye doesn't go to it.


Dizzy.

What is the advantage in doing it that way? Self-testing maybe?
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby Abacus » 04 Aug 2010, 09:43

smithsgj wrote:
ironlady wrote:My readers just use the Hanyu Pinyin (or TOP romanization) on the following page. You can turn back and forth when you need it, but your eye doesn't go to it.


Dizzy.

What is the advantage in doing it that way? Self-testing maybe?


If there is pinyin on the page then you read the pinyin instead of the characters. If there are only characters then you read the characters but you can easily look up the pinyin if needed. At least that is my experience.
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby Dragonbones » 04 Aug 2010, 10:46

I used to slide a ruler down the page to cover up the pinyin, otherwise my eyes would go to that, as you say.
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby smithsgj » 04 Aug 2010, 12:23

Abacus wrote:
smithsgj wrote:
ironlady wrote:My readers just use the Hanyu Pinyin (or TOP romanization) on the following page. You can turn back and forth when you need it, but your eye doesn't go to it.


Dizzy.

What is the advantage in doing it that way? Self-testing maybe?


If there is pinyin on the page then you read the pinyin instead of the characters. If there are only characters then you read the characters but you can easily look up the pinyin if needed. At least that is my experience.


OK. That's what I meant by self-testing. You refer to the other page to check comprehension, rather than access both forms in all cases and learn/get-reinforcement from the process. This must be why ruby/same page access evolved, no?

IL implied by saying "but your eye doesn't go to it" that the same page system has advantages, without clarifying (for me at least) the advantages of her system. Abacus confirmed that you think it's for self-testing. IL?
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby Icon » 11 Aug 2010, 09:44

My reply to an inquiry on a different topic:

Hi girl,

Don't tell me that, I already enrolled at NTNU for my first year of Chinesse. Why do you say is going to be tought?
De veras me voy arrepentir???[/quote]


The problem is that in teh first level you with zero knowledge are in teh same class with Jaopanese and Korean who understand written form -imagine you learning Italian or French, you would have a head up because of similarities- or people who have BAs or even MAs in Chinese and are there at lower levels because of the visa thinghie. They cannot handle a true beginner.

Furthermore, the methodology is repetitive, uncreative, boring and isolated from teh environment outside. They devised the book and stick to it religiously. The teachers are very dogmatic and have already made up their minds about Latino students because of previous generations. Hence, you will not be taught how to use the dictionary, radicals, etc. unless you ask for and are very persistent. No nos tratan ni en serio ni igual. You need to be very "respectful" with the teachers and staff, lots of kowtowing. You make them lose face, or if they thing you are annoying, and you are out of this country in a heartbeat. Remember they control the visa thinghies. And may forget to pass on important information.

Housing around Shi-Da is getting way too expensive. The books have been divided up and will be even more expensive than before. The other places are using teh same books but you will not be paying as much in housing/food expenses.
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby bismarck » 12 Aug 2010, 00:22

Icon wrote:My reply to an inquiry on a different topic:

Icon's friend wrote wrote:Hi girl,

Don't tell me that, I already enrolled at NTNU for my first year of Chinesse. Why do you say is going to be tought?
De veras me voy arrepentir???



The problem is that in teh first level you with zero knowledge are in teh same class with Jaopanese and Korean who understand written form -imagine you learning Italian or French, you would have a head up because of similarities- or people who have BAs or even MAs in Chinese and are there at lower levels because of the visa thinghie. They cannot handle a true beginner.

Furthermore, the methodology is repetitive, uncreative, boring and isolated from teh environment outside. They devised the book and stick to it religiously. The teachers are very dogmatic and have already made up their minds about Latino students because of previous generations. Hence, you will not be taught how to use the dictionary, radicals, etc. unless you ask for and are very persistent. No nos tratan ni en serio ni igual. You need to be very "respectful" with the teachers and staff, lots of kowtowing. You make them lose face, or if they thing you are annoying, and you are out of this country in a heartbeat. Remember they control the visa thinghies. And may forget to pass on important information.

Housing around Shi-Da is getting way too expensive. The books have been divided up and will be even more expensive than before. The other places are using teh same books but you will not be paying as much in housing/food expenses.

That sounds like a right load of shite. Tell your buddy to come study Chinese at NCKU in Tainan.
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby steelersman » 12 Aug 2010, 00:35

Icon wrote:My reply to an inquiry on a different topic:

Hi girl,

Don't tell me that, I already enrolled at NTNU for my first year of Chinesse. Why do you say is going to be tought?
De veras me voy arrepentir???



The problem is that in teh first level you with zero knowledge are in teh same class with Jaopanese and Korean who understand written form -imagine you learning Italian or French, you would have a head up because of similarities- or people who have BAs or even MAs in Chinese and are there at lower levels because of the visa thinghie. They cannot handle a true beginner.

Furthermore, the methodology is repetitive, uncreative, boring and isolated from teh environment outside. They devised the book and stick to it religiously. The teachers are very dogmatic and have already made up their minds about Latino students because of previous generations. Hence, you will not be taught how to use the dictionary, radicals, etc. unless you ask for and are very persistent. No nos tratan ni en serio ni igual. You need to be very "respectful" with the teachers and staff, lots of kowtowing. You make them lose face, or if they thing you are annoying, and you are out of this country in a heartbeat. Remember they control the visa thinghies. And may forget to pass on important information.

Housing around Shi-Da is getting way too expensive. The books have been divided up and will be even more expensive than before. The other places are using teh same books but you will not be paying as much in housing/food expenses.[/quote]


I do agree that for the most part the teachers at Shi-Da or not very good. One even didn't tell me that the review meant a test.
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby Icon » 12 Aug 2010, 10:11

IF by "teaching" you mean reading from the book and leading a cacophonic chorus, well, yeah, then that's NTNU's teaching for you. It has nothing to do with the age of the instructors, but rather their attitude and lack of real training.

The thing is that they use the same tests, you see, and people pass around those, so "smart" students get good grades.

To all involved: get good grades, don't skip classes, kowtow and you'll be all right. You can do your own language learning outside -will have to, actually. The tests do not and will not reflect your learning. What you do in the classroom and what happens outisde are totally different worlds.
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby Abacus » 13 Aug 2010, 22:35

Icon wrote:IF by "teaching" you mean reading from the book and leading a cacophonic chorus, well, yeah, then that's NTNU's teaching for you. It has nothing to do with the age of the instructors, but rather their attitude and lack of real training.

The thing is that they use the same tests, you see, and people pass around those, so "smart" students get good grades.

To all involved: get good grades, don't skip classes, kowtow and you'll be all right. You can do your own language learning outside -will have to, actually. The tests do not and will not reflect your learning. What you do in the classroom and what happens outisde are totally different worlds.


I took a university course for the first book (different book/university) and I was generally unimpressed by the course. A lot of time and a lot of money to basically read thru the book. Zero creativity in lesson planning. I think there is very little chance that I'll go back. Now if I only had enough self discipline to self-study...
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Re: Choosing between programs, e.g. NTNU, NTU's CLD and NCCU

Postby Icon » 14 Aug 2010, 11:26

There are other options in teaching -other universities, language schools, tutors- but unfortunately, we are stuck with that awful book per secula e seculorum....
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