Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Forum rules
When posting, especially when starting a new thread, please use a title that explains your post or thread, e.g. don't put "Help please!" when you could put "Where can I find a camp site near Kending?"

Please check your spelling, because someone may do a text search for your information, e.g. if someone searches for information on Xizhi and you have spelled it She Jher, they won't find it. Someone spelled camping as "campin" without a g at the end - again, it can't be found by a text search. For place names in Taiwan, please try to use Hanyu Pinyin as default, as that is the spelling most people know.

Please place links in your posts to sources of information. If you don't know how to hotlink text, click on the BBCode tips link in my signature to find out.

If you find a thread that is so hopelessly out of date that it couldn't be of use to anyone, please send the moderator a private message (with the URL of the thread)

If you spot two or more threads that you think could be merged, again, alert the moderator

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby Confuzius » 24 May 2012, 00:47

Muzha Man wrote:
Confuzius wrote:...Since Taiwan would fit into 41 of the 50 US states (ie smaller than 41 of the states) your comparison is insanely flawed.


Not at all. What has size got to do with it? Cities and even smaller municipalities often have local resident rates as well. What matters is the entirely arbritrary political divisions within a country and not their relative size compared to others.


It has everything to do with it. Many of the discounts in the US are state wide, so actually the residents within an area of about 5-10 times the size of Taiwan have to pay a different price than everyone else on the planet.

If you think the US resident prices being different are wrong too, well, thats another thing.
"Knowledge alone is transitory, the outcrop subsequent to 'I desire all things'". - A. O. Spare
Confuzius
Betelnut Beauty (bīnglang Xī Shī)
Betelnut Beauty (bīnglang Xī Shī)
 
Posts: 1524
Joined: 05 Jun 2011, 08:09
113 Recommends(s)
76 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby Abacus » 24 May 2012, 01:24

I think Confuzius simply loves to debate whether or not he actually believes in a position.

Even if there are some state parks with different rates it doesn't matter. Why not? Because the concern here is that tourists get annoyed with the double pricing policy. It might be hard to imagine but tourists do remember these types of things even if it's a trivial amount in a vacation budget. The bigger concern is that we'll see the policy extend nationwide. Why is this a concern? Tourism growth. Taiwan is actually underrated as a destination but the industry definitely won't grow with a double pricing policy. There are a lot of other reasons that it won't grow but this just adds to them.
Abacus
Presidential Advisor (zǒng tǒng gù wèn)
Presidential Advisor (zǒng tǒng gù wèn)
 
Posts: 3093
Joined: 20 Aug 2009, 08:14
Location: Kaohsiung
88 Recommends(s)
100 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby Mucha Man » 24 May 2012, 01:49

Confuzius wrote:
Muzha Man wrote:
Confuzius wrote:...Since Taiwan would fit into 41 of the 50 US states (ie smaller than 41 of the states) your comparison is insanely flawed.


Not at all. What has size got to do with it? Cities and even smaller municipalities often have local resident rates as well. What matters is the entirely arbritrary political divisions within a country and not their relative size compared to others.


It has everything to do with it. Many of the discounts in the US are state wide, so actually the residents within an area of about 5-10 times the size of Taiwan have to pay a different price than everyone else on the planet.


I'm sorry but that just isn't convincing. Size has no bearing on this. States, countries cities, towns, etc, vary all across the world both in size and population.

Your argument seems to be that because Taiwan is smaller than most US states then a two-tier pricing policy here is simply the same as a statewide resident advantage program over there. Only it isn't. Again, Taiwanese are not getting a discount. Foreigners are being charged more.
“Everywhere else in the world is also really old” said Prof. Liu, a renowned historian at Beijing University. “We always learn that China has 5000 years of cultural heritage, and that therefore we are very special. It appears that other places also have some of this heritage stuff. And are also old. Like, really old.”

http://hikingintaiwan.blogspot.com/
Forumosan avatar
Mucha Man
Guan Yin (Guānyīn)
 
Posts: 17840
Joined: 01 Nov 2001, 17:01
Location: Mucha, of course
636 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby GuyInTaiwan » 24 May 2012, 08:53

superking wrote:I wonder if there is a secret key on governmental computer keyboards that they can push to generate a random bullshit excuse at the touch of a button.


I laughed out loud at this. If there isn't, have you thought about marketing it? Much like my idea of having an attachment on a person's scooter that burns ghost money so they won't have an accident, it could make a fortune.

To be fair though, I think dealing with most government departments in most countries entails a certain amount of bullshit. Try getting anything done with a local council in Australia, for instance!
And you coming in to scold us all like some kind of sour-puss kindie assistant who favors olive cardigans and lemon drinks without sugar. -- Muzha Man

One sometimes gets the impression that the mere words "Socialism" and "Communism" draw towards them with magnetic force every fruit-juice drinker, nudist, sandal-wearer, sex-maniac, Quaker, "Nature Cure" quack, pacifist, and feminist in England. -- George Orwell
GuyInTaiwan
Entering Second Childhood (èrdù tóngnián qī)
Entering Second Childhood (èrdù tóngnián qī)
 
Posts: 7231
Joined: 10 Jun 2008, 23:01
341 Recommends(s)
269 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby Mawvellous » 24 May 2012, 08:59

Muzha Man wrote:Yes, there is a theoretical foreigner quota but in reality I have never seen it effectively used except for members of AIT and foreign embassies.



Actually, there does appear to be an official foreign quota - and from what a number of people have told me, it is much easier for foreigners to get permits. I got a permit at the second attempt, which was either due to the foreigner quota or a large slice of luck given the fact that Paiyun is massively oversubscribed, even in the week.
Mawvellous
Gravel Truck Driver (suìshí chē sījī)
Gravel Truck Driver (suìshí chē sījī)
 
Posts: 1391
Joined: 11 Aug 2006, 10:59
2 Recommends(s)
7 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby Omniloquacious » 24 May 2012, 09:57

Abacus wrote: Why is this a concern? Tourism growth. Taiwan is actually underrated as a destination but the industry definitely won't grow with a double pricing policy.


It will grow, though. For every Westerner, Japanese or Southeast Asian who decides to give it a miss, ten or a hundred more Chinese will come flocking over from the mainland in tour groups or as independent travelers. There are more than enough potential tourists across the Taiwan Strait to totally engulf Taiwan's receptive capacity. They're the easiest tourists to lure over, and the easiest to cater to. The government and the tourism industry will be happy enough to milk them for all they're worth, and won't mind too much if the numbers of visitors from elsewhere fall short of what they could be if the utmost effort were made to attract and accommodate them.
If I prioritized the acquisition of wealth above other purposes in life, I might still have come to Taiwan to study Chinese, but I doubt I would have remained here.
寸金難買寸光陰
Forumosan avatar
Omniloquacious
Retired President (tuì xiū de zǒng tǒng)
Retired President (tuì xiū de zǒng tǒng)
 
Posts: 5627
Joined: 24 Sep 2002, 14:15
Location: The 鳥不生蛋狗不拉屎 wasteland of Linkou
62 Recommends(s)
186 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby Feiren » 24 May 2012, 10:08

If there really is a quota, it should appear in the written rule by law or it should be possible to get information about it with a freedom of information request.

The question to ask the officials are:

1. Is there a quota for foreigners that can be accessed with the higher price?

2. If so, which law or regulation creates the quota?

3. How many foreigners applied and received places this way over the last there years.

All of this information should be readily available or something is wrong.






Mawvellous wrote:
Muzha Man wrote:Yes, there is a theoretical foreigner quota but in reality I have never seen it effectively used except for members of AIT and foreign embassies.



Actually, there does appear to be an official foreign quota - and from what a number of people have told me, it is much easier for foreigners to get permits. I got a permit at the second attempt, which was either due to the foreigner quota or a large slice of luck given the fact that Paiyun is massively oversubscribed, even in the week.
Feiren
Former City Mayor (qiánrèn shìzhǎng)
Former City Mayor (qiánrèn shìzhǎng)
 
Posts: 4838
Joined: 05 Jan 2002, 17:01
Location: Drum Tower
4 Recommends(s)
186 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby GuyInTaiwan » 24 May 2012, 10:15

Omniloquacious wrote:
Abacus wrote: Why is this a concern? Tourism growth. Taiwan is actually underrated as a destination but the industry definitely won't grow with a double pricing policy.


It will grow, though. For every Westerner, Japanese or Southeast Asian who decides to give it a miss, ten or a hundred more Chinese will come flocking over from the mainland in tour groups or as independent travelers. There are more than enough potential tourists across the Taiwan Strait to totally engulf Taiwan's receptive capacity. They're the easiest tourists to lure over, and the easiest to cater to. The government and the tourism industry will be happy enough to milk them for all they're worth, and won't mind too much if the numbers of visitors from elsewhere fall short of what they could be if the utmost effort were made to attract and accommodate them.


This is probably right on the money. It's like Egypt with the pyramids. The locals can be complete idiots, but it won't matter because if you want to see the pyramids, it's not like you can go to Canada or Belgium instead. So, there's always going to be a huge market, regardless.
And you coming in to scold us all like some kind of sour-puss kindie assistant who favors olive cardigans and lemon drinks without sugar. -- Muzha Man

One sometimes gets the impression that the mere words "Socialism" and "Communism" draw towards them with magnetic force every fruit-juice drinker, nudist, sandal-wearer, sex-maniac, Quaker, "Nature Cure" quack, pacifist, and feminist in England. -- George Orwell
GuyInTaiwan
Entering Second Childhood (èrdù tóngnián qī)
Entering Second Childhood (èrdù tóngnián qī)
 
Posts: 7231
Joined: 10 Jun 2008, 23:01
341 Recommends(s)
269 Recognized(s)

6000

Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby headhonchoII » 24 May 2012, 10:42

sandman wrote:Just was talking about this to the girls in the office, all of whom studied overseas. All of whom discovered that they were paying many, many, many times the prices charged to local students. Their reactions, one and all? Are you allowed to say "Fuck off," on the flob these days? There is NO sympathy among the educated here about a foreigner fee -- they've have enough of it themselves.


Yeah well they can pay for more all tourism sites overseas then if they want to. This kind of logic is pretty sad and nobody forced them to study overseas and choose expensive courses but they chose to so they could get paid more in Taiwan.
I can remember the fourth of July runnin' through the backwood bare.
And I can still hear my old hound dog barkin' chasin' down a hoodoo there
Chasin' down a hoodoo there.
headhonchoII
Maitreya Buddha (Mílèfó)
 
Posts: 11668
Joined: 26 Aug 2002, 10:40
Location: Taipei
1314 Recommends(s)
504 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: Climbing Mount Jade to cost foreigners NT$700, but locals just NT$220

Postby sandman » 24 May 2012, 10:59

headhonchoII wrote:
sandman wrote:Just was talking about this to the girls in the office, all of whom studied overseas. All of whom discovered that they were paying many, many, many times the prices charged to local students. Their reactions, one and all? Are you allowed to say "Fuck off," on the flob these days? There is NO sympathy among the educated here about a foreigner fee -- they've have enough of it themselves.


Yeah well they can pay for more all tourism sites overseas then if they want to. This kind of logic is pretty sad and nobody forced them to study overseas and choose expensive courses but they chose to so they could get paid more in Taiwan.

Sad or not, its the case. And as Omni (?) pointed out, every time you read anything at all about the government's tourism efforts, change every reference to International, foreign guests, etc., to "Chinese." Really, that's all they're interested in. Japanese and Koreans to a far lesser extent. They couldn't give two hoots about a few Americans or Europeans, and who could blame them. Where's the profit in that?
sandman
Manjusri (Wénshū)
 
Posts: 30176
Joined: 04 Jun 2001, 16:01
28 Recommends(s)
196 Recognized(s)

6000

PreviousNext




 
 
 x

Return to Travel in Taiwan



Who is online

Forumosans browsing this forum: No Forumosans and 2 visitors

Men for the sake of getting a living forget to live -- MARGARET FULLER