scott sommers article on "class currency" in taiwan

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Postby maoman » 11 Jun 2007, 02:11

Namahottie wrote:Class is tantamount to access to resources.

I disagree. In Taiwan, access to resources that are not readily available to all is good guanxi. Having good guanxi does not make you a member of the upper class - it just means that you know a lot of people, or if not a lot, a few of the right ones.
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Postby ironlady » 11 Jun 2007, 04:50

ScottSommers wrote:This is no doubt true. Every life is an individual life based on individual choices. However, I analyzed statistics provided by the ROC Ministry of Interior to reach this conclusion. Once again, I suggest that you have a look at the original link for more details.


Scott, you and I and everyone who has ever read an academic journal knows (or should know) that it is not the numbers, but what the numbers MEAN, that counts. No one doubts the original numbers -- what we disagree with is your interpretation of the numbers, for such it is. Some conclusions can be drawn from certain data, and other conclusions cannot be validly drawn.

To say there are significant differences between groups in the first place requires certain statistical operations based on sample size and the number of people in each group. And if the differences between groups do reach a reasonable threshold for statistical significance, you then have to try to explain why. In your "experiment" or analysis of the numbers, there is no control for other factors, and you cannot simply wave them off as inconvenient so as to stick to your hypothesis.

The basic definition of social class is, of course, another huge potential pitfall in the analysis. But that is another question. And I certainly don't want to subject you to monotony by reiterating anything.
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Postby ironlady » 11 Jun 2007, 04:56

Namahottie wrote:[


Receiving welfare is not tantamount to being in a certain social class. And anyway, since until recently I (supposedly more or less middle class) did not have health insurance, I routinely saw welfare recipients in my primary caregiver's office, as I had to go to the emergency room for treatment when things got that serious. Class does not guarantee access to resources. It may predict it, but it does not guarantee it. I may have been of a higher social class than those in the waiting room with me, but we were both accessing the same reosurces - the only ones available to us.

I'll give you another example. I recently did an interpreting job here in the States for a man in his late 40s who was marrying a Chinese woman. In the course of this pre-nup, I saw his financial statements. He has what is considered to be a blue-collar job -- i.e., lower middle class, most likely, if you look only at the employment. His net worth, though, is about five times what mine is (and I save like a fiend :( ). He has access to far more resources than I do, but I would likely be perceived as higher in social class (hierarchy/status) because of my profession and my educational attainment (he has a high school diploma, I have several graduate degrees).
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Postby Fox » 11 Jun 2007, 11:17

No wonder sociologists are unemployable. There are only two classes the super rich and the aspirationals. Ask the super rich and they'll tell you the same. Ask the aspirationals and they'll tell you they're middle class.
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Re: scott sommers article on "class currency" in taiwan

Postby ScottSommers » 25 Nov 2011, 15:58

I know it was a long time ago, but if you were interested in this post, you might want to see this paper

Lan, Pei-Chia. White Privilege, Language Capital, and Cultural Ghettolization: Western High-Skilled Migrants in Taiwan. Journal of Ethnic and Migration Studies, forthcoming.

which discusses the blog posts of mine that we were talking about.

You can download a copy of this paper from Google by searching for the title.

If you haven't been following my blog, you may not know that I don't post anymore. The links cited in this paper aren't active. You can still find the original posts here,

Foreign English Teachers as Economic Migrants
http://backupposts.wordpress.com/2009/0 ... -migrants/

I'm having a little trouble locating the second paper, which is ‘Foreign teachers as entry level workers in the cultural industry'
When I find it, I'll post the link.

I may write a response depending on when the paper appears.
Becoming Taiwan: From Colonialism to Democracy, by Ann Heylen and Scott Sommers is now available on Google Books http://www.amazon.com/Becoming-Taiwan-Colonialism-Democracy-Formosiana/dp/3447063742

"Who Still Believes in 9/11 Conspiracies? An Empirical Study on Political Affiliation and Conspiratorial Thinking," by Scott Sommers
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Re: scott sommers article on "class currency" in taiwan

Postby amarbaines » 25 Nov 2011, 21:39

Scott - thanks for this. I am about to devour it. If I have something meaningful to say in response, I'll post here.

http://sociology.ntu.edu.tw/~pclan/docu ... vilege.pdf
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Re: scott sommers article on "class currency" in taiwan

Postby ScottSommers » 25 Nov 2011, 22:00

I haven't really had a detailed look at Pei Chia's paper. I read an earlier draft, but she seems to have changed quite a bit since then. But that would be great if you have any comments about the topic. I'm probably going to write a response to her and it would be great to field some of the ideas here.
Becoming Taiwan: From Colonialism to Democracy, by Ann Heylen and Scott Sommers is now available on Google Books http://www.amazon.com/Becoming-Taiwan-Colonialism-Democracy-Formosiana/dp/3447063742

"Who Still Believes in 9/11 Conspiracies? An Empirical Study on Political Affiliation and Conspiratorial Thinking," by Scott Sommers
The Skeptic Magazine, Volume 16 Number 2
available here

comments about 9/11 conspiracy on the Independent Sentinel
available here
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Re: scott sommers article on "class currency" in taiwan

Postby sandman » 26 Nov 2011, 00:53

ScottSommers wrote:I haven't really had a detailed look at Pei Chia's paper. I read an earlier draft, but she seems to have changed quite a bit since then. But that would be great if you have any comments about the topic. I'm probably going to write a response to her and it would be great to field some of the ideas here.

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Re: scott sommers article on "class currency" in taiwan

Postby jp_mtl » 26 Nov 2011, 11:14

Scott Sommers (2005a) has proposed a thesis about economic migration of English teachers on his blog, which attracted attention and generated controversy in the expatriate community in Taiwan. As an English teacher himself, he noticed that the vast majority working in the industry are ‘young, single, marginally employed holders of liberal arts degrees.’ He provocatively argues that they are economic migrants marginalized by a shrunken labor market in the West as a result of capital outflow and global outsourcing.

Provocatively argues? :roflmao:
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Re: scott sommers article on "class currency" in taiwan

Postby jp_mtl » 26 Nov 2011, 11:19

So in sociology it is provocative to point out that young, single graduates come to Asia to teach English because they can't find a decent job in their home country?

Is it also "provocative" to point out that Taiwanese are not the best drivers in the world?
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