My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Can a foreigner buy...? Can a foreigner rent...? What about deposits? Bad neighbors? Unreasonable landlords? Miscellaneous problems?
Forum rules
While the moderators are happy to help point people in the right direction for legal assistance and to attempt to keep these forums civil and tidy, please bear in mind that an Internet forum is not the place for providing or receiving legal advice or for the creation of any attorney-client privileges or obligations. Also keep in mind that Forumosa and the moderators cannot conduct comprehensive reviews of all laws or legal concepts referenced or discussed within these forums – laws and regulations are updated and amended, interpretations do change, and sometimes the legal landscape can change very fast. Forumosa provides these legal forums for general informational purposes only. By using these legal forums, you agree that the information does not constitute legal or other professional advice and no attorney-client or other relationship is created between you and any other posters on these forums. DO NOT CONSIDER THE FORUMS TO BE A SUBSTITUTE FOR OBTAINING LEGAL ADVICE FROM A QUALIFIED LICENSED ATTORNEY.

My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby Taiwan for Life » 04 Nov 2006, 11:29

Hi all,
Seeing as in recent weeks, I have consulted this forum, I felt I was duty bound to write and let everyone know my experience. I have contacted a few of you personally and I thank you for your replies.

This long story begins with our decision to sell our 32.8 ping flat with car space. We bought it a year ago and renovated it. We had intended to stay here for a while but whilst out on the north coast a few weeks ago fell in love with a house right by the sea. We decided to buy that house and so needed to sell this flat to fund the deal. Our place in Taipei was already on the market as we had wanted to test the waters.

About five months ago we received a bid of 7.6 million which at the time we turned down. Once we had found the place on the coast that we wanted to buy, we went back to the real estate agent and told them that if anyone offered a similar price again we would accept. I expected them to contact the person who had made the original bid but apparently he was "not available". In the meantime, they brought other families round ane we were told a couple had made bids of around 6.7 million and would we consider lowering our price. After a lot of persuading we lowered to 7.2 million. What I didn't realise at the time was that the new price was for anyone to come and bid for, not just those specific families we were negotiating with at that time.

The next day we received a call from the real estate saying that they had found the original bidder and he was now willing to pay 7.2 million. I found the whole thing suspicious and had many theories running through my mind. Were they still selling it to him for the original price and taking a larger cut for themselves? Had they in fact found him, or was someone else going to buy our place and then sell it to him? Were the families they brought round just a scam to get us to lower our price because in fact they had found the original bidder all the time?

Anyway the real estate said that because someone had met our price, the deal had effectively been done. They were getting nervous as at that time only two days remained on our contract with them and they were about to miss out on all their commission. We refused to recognise the sale saying that just because someone had met our price did not mean the sale had gone through, after all we hadn't discussed payment terms, moving out dates etc. They started to pressurize us saying that if we changed our mind, we might be liable to a 4% penalty. It all became very stressful and worrying with us at some points thinking that we were going to lose our house completely. We realised that owners without a mortgage such as us were effectively in a dangerous position as the deeds of the house are changed before the final payment is made. Therefore, one has to get a large downpayment to lower the risk. I started to make difficult demands like 70% up front and a moving out date of middle of February. Eventually it came down to a meeting with the buyer, the real estate agent, and us on the night before the contract ended.

I was so angry and suspicious that I took along a tape recorder and with everyone's permission taped the conversation. I said that in the event of needing a lawyer, that it would be useful to have a record of the conversation.

I made a point of wanting to see all of the paperwork, none of which could be produced - specifically I wanted to see if the other bids really existed. I also said openly in front of the buyer that we were to receive 7.2 million at which point he became very angry saying the real estate had told him we were to receive 7.5 million. They had even told him that someone else had made a bid equal to his and that he should pay an extra 50,000 to secure it. As you can imagine no deal was made that night. Fortunately it was he who backed out of the deal, so the real estate could not accuse us of changing our minds.

That was two days ago. Since then we have advertised privately within our community and have accepted a bid of 7.5 million, with 80% up front. We are now nearing the end of this terrible experience.

I hope this helps others. I would advise people to watch agents here very carefully. We hired them to protect us from others who might try to do something underhand never realising that it was them who would try something like that.

This post was recommended by 2 Forumosans: Dr Jellyfish (26 Mar 2014, 12:46), maunaloa (19 Dec 2011, 02:55)
Rating: 11.76%
Taiwan for Life
English Teacher with Headband (bǎng tóujīn de Yīngwén lǎoshī)
English Teacher with Headband (bǎng tóujīn de Yīngwén lǎoshī)
 
Posts: 150
ORIGINAL POSTER
Joined: 14 Oct 2006, 08:49
5 Recognized(s)

6000

Postby blacksheep » 04 Nov 2006, 13:46

Thanks for the heads up.
I have been discussing with my partner about purchasing a house here but in K-Town and didn't think such a blatant abuse of client trust and deception could occur. Of course, real estate agents is the second least trusted occupation next to secondhand car salesmen. Now we know why.
blacksheep
Ink Still Wet in Passport (shífēn xīnshǒu)
Ink Still Wet in Passport (shífēn xīnshǒu)
 
Posts: 7
Joined: 27 May 2006, 11:49
Location: Australia

6000

Re: My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby ironfist » 17 Dec 2011, 02:53

when you agreed to sell it for 7.2 million, did you changed the contract or was it verbal? It should just have been with that particular couple and not 7.2 for all the bidders.

Yes usually it's like 10% payment when you sign the contract to the buyer, then another payment after the tax thing is done, not sure exactly what's that....then a final payment. and the 2 later payments I ain't sure of the % maybe half half? So you wanted 80% up front was that the 1st payment or 2nd payment? also do you know exactly when does the house's ownership gets transferred to the new owner? was it after the tax thing or at the final payment? I am thinking about selling the house or rent it out, but either way I am afraid, if I rent it out and I ain't here all the time I don't know what will happen..but thanks for sharing and it's an old thread so please reply and educate me if possible
ironfist
Night Market Cop (yè shì tiáo zi)
Night Market Cop (yè shì tiáo zi)
 
Posts: 825
Joined: 05 Mar 2005, 02:34
Location: Kaohsiung
1 Recommends(s)

6000

Re: My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby Taiwan for Life » 17 Dec 2011, 21:56

Ironfist,
I wish I could give you exact answers, but that was five years ago, now and it's all hazy. I do remember being very stressed about it. However, I don't think it is the norm, and I think I just had some bad luck with the real estate agent I met. In the end, they got nothing, because we made a private deal with the buyer of the house. Incidentally, the buyer, was an educated wealthy man who couldn't have been more accommodating, so I suppose, it's swings and roundabouts..

I will say this, if you are worried, you should get a good daishu.....
Taiwan for Life
English Teacher with Headband (bǎng tóujīn de Yīngwén lǎoshī)
English Teacher with Headband (bǎng tóujīn de Yīngwén lǎoshī)
 
Posts: 150
ORIGINAL POSTER
Joined: 14 Oct 2006, 08:49
5 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby igorveni » 17 Dec 2011, 23:02

Do you remember which real estate company was it?
igorveni
Mando-pop Singer (Guóyǔ liúxíng gēshǒu)
Mando-pop Singer (Guóyǔ liúxíng gēshǒu)
 
Posts: 2314
Joined: 06 Feb 2004, 12:48
Location: Taipei
1 Recommends(s)
5 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby golf » 18 Dec 2011, 04:15

For you expats, I suugest you only hire those big agents: 信義、永慶、住商、中信、有巢氏 (Century 21)。東森sucks. Bad agents play alot of tricks, such as offering you very low price and have their relatives buy your house and re-sell it immediately at a higher price. Before signing any agent contract, ask around more agents or ask for recommendations from your local friends. Those agents don't only accept nearby houses, but also in the whole Taiwan.
https://www.google.com.tw/#q=%E8%96%91% ... A%E5%A3%AB
Get to the 1st Facebook page result (薑博士), click "Like" and:
Stay tuned with the world's most innovative drying technology that will change the territories of the world's food industry.

This post was recommended by TainanCowboy (18 Dec 2011, 08:59)
Rating: 5.88%
Forumosan avatar
golf
Chair-throwing Legislator (rēng yǐzi de lìfǎ wěiyuán)
Chair-throwing Legislator (rēng yǐzi de lìfǎ wěiyuán)
 
Posts: 300
Joined: 20 May 2010, 08:12
Location: Taipei, Hualien, Pingtung
15 Recommends(s)
12 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby ironfist » 19 Dec 2011, 01:32

those agents also accept anywhere in Taiwan? but how are they going to show the house in Taipei if their branch is located in Kaohsiung? they just give away that house to their Taipei branch co-workers?

my agent is from 永慶 but her branch is 加盟, that means her branch is an independent company right? what's the difference and is it ok to have her as my agent?

If in the contract you want they to sell the house for at least 1 million NTD, but they can only find buyer that can do .95 million. You don't owe them any commission if you don't take that offer right? If you take that offer you need to sign another contract again? also what's the commission fee like in Kaohsiung area? they want 4% but it's 3%? but if it's a big house maybe you can get it down to 2%? thanks guys
ironfist
Night Market Cop (yè shì tiáo zi)
Night Market Cop (yè shì tiáo zi)
 
Posts: 825
Joined: 05 Mar 2005, 02:34
Location: Kaohsiung
1 Recommends(s)

6000

Re: My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby tommy525 » 19 Dec 2011, 02:02

Its a quagmire, but i guess one way to look at it is you make your money and let your agent make his, as long as he meets what you want to sell the house for allow him to make more then the allotted 4pct if he can.

Will there be shenanigans, sure.

Get your money ! Don't worry bout the rest.

Or go with the bigger agents and insist on meeting buyers in person immediately before pricing is fixed.
the driveller - tommy525
Forumosan avatar
tommy525
Guan Yin (Guānyīn)
 
Posts: 17423
Joined: 14 Sep 2006, 17:25
Location: calif baby !
477 Recommends(s)
317 Recognized(s)

6000

Re: My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby bumclouds » 27 Feb 2012, 01:17

tommy525 wrote:Its a quagmire, but i guess one way to look at it is you make your money and let your agent make his, as long as he meets what you want to sell the house for allow him to make more then the allotted 4pct if he can.
Will there be shenanigans, sure.


But stop! It's not that simple. Did you ever read the real state agents chapter of "Freakonomics"?
Your warning level: [3]
Forumosan avatar
bumclouds
Night Market Cop (yè shì tiáo zi)
Night Market Cop (yè shì tiáo zi)
 
Posts: 897
Joined: 01 Jun 2010, 14:52
Location: Taipei
88 Recommends(s)
54 Recognized(s)

6000

My (complicated) story - and a warning to others

Postby headhonchoII » 27 Feb 2012, 08:23

Just like anything shop around first to compare what they are saying.
I can remember the fourth of July runnin' through the backwood bare.
And I can still hear my old hound dog barkin' chasin' down a hoodoo there
Chasin' down a hoodoo there.
headhonchoII
Maitreya Buddha (Mílèfó)
 
Posts: 11665
Joined: 26 Aug 2002, 10:40
Location: Taipei
1307 Recommends(s)
504 Recognized(s)

6000

Next




 
 
 x

Return to Legal Issues in Real Estate & Housing



Who is online

Forumosans browsing this forum: No Forumosans and 1 visitor

The swift years slip and slide adown the steep;
The slow years pass; neither will come again.
-- WILLIAM SHARP