Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby urodacus » 26 Mar 2009, 16:33

Not really an update on the situation, but a bit more background: here is the sub base on Hainan Island that the Chinese are desperately trying to keep hush hush, from both publicity and sonar... an old picture, i admit. I guess that US has much clearer pictures these days!

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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby Elegua » 26 Mar 2009, 16:55

For sure. What you want to do is drag some towed-arrays over the approaches, which is the easiest way to pick up the subs as they leave.
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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby lbksig » 26 Mar 2009, 17:03

Elegua wrote:For sure. What you want to do is drag some towed-arrays over the approaches, which is the easiest way to pick up the subs as they leave.


What I don't understand is why the Chinese didn't just have tons of noisy boats near the US vessel. Sound travels well underwater, but the distance between the sub emitting an acoustic signature and the US vessel is large. The distance between some crappy 20 year old barge that's making tons of noise is small and the US vessel can be much smaller. If you got a couple dozen fisherman chugging along a few hundred yards away, wouldn't that accomplish your goal without causing an international incident?
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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby Jack Burton » 26 Mar 2009, 17:19

lbksig wrote:
Elegua wrote:For sure. What you want to do is drag some towed-arrays over the approaches, which is the easiest way to pick up the subs as they leave.


What I don't understand is why the Chinese didn't just have tons of noisy boats near the US vessel. Sound travels well underwater, but the distance between the sub emitting an acoustic signature and the US vessel is large. The distance between some crappy 20 year old barge that's making tons of noise is small and the US vessel can be much smaller. If you got a couple dozen fisherman chugging along a few hundred yards away, wouldn't that accomplish your goal without causing an international incident?


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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby Elegua » 26 Mar 2009, 18:05

lbksig wrote:
Elegua wrote:For sure. What you want to do is drag some towed-arrays over the approaches, which is the easiest way to pick up the subs as they leave.


What I don't understand is why the Chinese didn't just have tons of noisy boats near the US vessel. Sound travels well underwater, but the distance between the sub emitting an acoustic signature and the US vessel is large. The distance between some crappy 20 year old barge that's making tons of noise is small and the US vessel can be much smaller. If you got a couple dozen fisherman chugging along a few hundred yards away, wouldn't that accomplish your goal without causing an international incident?


Frequencies and signals processing algorithms. One reason the US is ahead is not so much the gear as the signals processing. How do you think they got a bunch of sonars on the bottom of the ocean between Bermuda, Iceland, Scotland and the Azors to cover the entire atlantic ocean? For example, when the Scorpion sank they were able to ID the location.
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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby Jack el Tejano » 27 Mar 2009, 23:26

Elegua wrote:
lbksig wrote:
Elegua wrote:For sure. What you want to do is drag some towed-arrays over the approaches, which is the easiest way to pick up the subs as they leave.


What I don't understand is why the Chinese didn't just have tons of noisy boats near the US vessel. Sound travels well underwater, but the distance between the sub emitting an acoustic signature and the US vessel is large. The distance between some crappy 20 year old barge that's making tons of noise is small and the US vessel can be much smaller. If you got a couple dozen fisherman chugging along a few hundred yards away, wouldn't that accomplish your goal without causing an international incident?


Frequencies and signals processing algorithms. One reason the US is ahead is not so much the gear as the signals processing. How do you think they got a bunch of sonars on the bottom of the ocean between Bermuda, Iceland, Scotland and the Azors to cover the entire atlantic ocean? For example, when the Scorpion sank they were able to ID the location.



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1. this wouldn't be a problem if the Twentieth Century Communist Han weren't using the Nineteenth century Imperialist Manchu map of the world in the Twenty First century. The PROC is under the unfortunate delusion that they own all the drops of water clear down to Brunei. It isn't a matter of reciprocity (would the US be upset if it found Chinese subs sneaking around the bases in Washington or Georgia? Yes. But sixty miles off the coast, as someone said earlier, is fair game. Upset doesn't result in this silliness.) , but of the fact that the damn PROC doesn't recognize The International Law of the Sea when it comes to the South China Sea. It's freakin' international waters, people!

2. I think our little Impeccable is a red herring. all the sneaky work is being done by the NSA's midget subs. With actual midget crews. I seen 'em....

3. Besides if we let 'em get a navy, then China might actually become a real Empire and what not. Can't have that now can we?
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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby urodacus » 11 Apr 2012, 19:26

More Spratly shenanigans from China this week, with Chinese Navy and Chinese "fishing boats" harassing Philippine Navy vessel in the Spratly chain, when the Philippine navy attempts to prevent illegal Chinese harvesting of coral and fish from the Philippine archipelago.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/art ... 96d5d96322

Also, China protests Philippine development of Pag-Asa (aka Thitu) one of the largest islands and well established as Philippine (with hundreds of Filipino inhabitants).

http://www.chinapost.com.tw/asia/philip ... ratlys.htm



So, what's wrong with this map then, eh?
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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby Belgian Pie » 11 Apr 2012, 19:34

Clearly that the Spratlys belong to the Philippines and Brunei ... nothing to do with China! :noway:

Soon the Chinese will claim that Taiwan belongs to China ... :D
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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby fred smith » 12 Apr 2012, 00:08

Except that Taiwan has been in physical possession as the ROC of the major island in the Spratlys and has populated it and kept a base there for quite some time. This obviously and legally establishes the PRC claim to much of the region if as the world accepts Taiwan is part of ONE China. Now, we can disagree in a clever fashion about what that one China is but in reality that is the PRC.
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Re: Chinese ships surround and harass US Navy mapping ship

Postby Elegua » 12 Apr 2012, 11:40

Meh, it depends upon what is defined as an island by UNCLOS and whether you get territorial waters or an EEZ. Others also get a shot at ownership like the flips claim over Reeds Bank.

In any case there is no real legal basis for the nine dashed line other than the "might makes right", or the, "because I said so", clauses in International Law. Of course, in the 5,000 years of Chinese history, theses laws have well documented precedents.
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