A-Bian is sick

Topics related to Taiwan and Taiwan/China issues can be discussed here. Threads dealing with Taiwan's history belong in the Culture & History thread. Please do not post articles - use links instead. Quoted sources should be limited to one paragraph in length, or less. If you see a post that you feel is against the rules, please send a report to the moderators so we can look into it

Moderator: TheGingerMan

Forum rules
Threads dealing with Taiwan's history belong in the Culture & History thread. Please do not post articles - use links instead. Quoted sources should be limited to one paragraph in length, or less. If you see a post that you feel is against the rules, you can send a report to the moderators so we can look into it

A-Bian is sick

Postby ChewDawg » 12 Mar 2012, 06:56

I think it's bad that they didn't get him to the hospital sooner, but I don't know why his family and supporters are complaining about his 30 mins of exercise per day and lack of manual labour opportunities.

There are lots of prisoners in Supermax prisons in the US that are fit as a fiddle. Why? Because they do 1000s of push ups and sit ups in their cell, which are on 24-hour lockdown.

Chen, even as president, lived an inactive lifestyle. The health problems from an inactive lifestyle are cumulative and not necessarily because of his conditions in jail. It's the result of decades of neglect. With regard to working in prison, would Chen really want to work making joss sticks or washing clothes? If he was allowed to do this type of work, I am sure his supporters would say it was beneath a former president.

Hard time is exactly that---hard time. To me, there has been a repetitive pattern with Chen and his wife to use their ailments to get special conditions. If you do the crime, you should do the time no matter what your ailments are.

Taipei Times wrote:The US-based Formosan Association for Human Rights (FAHR) in a letter on Saturday condemned the “inhuman imprisonment conditions” faced by former president Chen Shui-bian (陳水扁) and called on the Presidential Office and Ministry of Justice to “set aside political motives” and grant Chen the hospital stay he needs to return to full health.

Chen, who is serving a 17-and-a-half-year prison sentence for corruption, was granted a temporary release from Taipei Prison on Tuesday for a medical checkup at Taoyuan General Hospital because of heath concerns. A series of tests revealed that he was suffering from an acute coronary syndrome and significantly reduced blood flow to the heart, a potentially fatal condition, the letter said.

Taipei Prison ignored Chen’s repeated requests for a hospital checkup for a month until pressure from 13 legislators persuaded it to relent, it said.

However, the prison authorities had planned to return Chen to prison immediately after the checkup.
Chen is currently in the intensive care unit after undergoing an urgent cardiac catheterization procedure on Wednesday. A small tumor was also found on his prostate during the examination.

Chen’s son, Chen Chih-chung, pointed out that his father has been jailed under an inhuman conditions and was allowed only 30 minutes each day for outdoor activities. Earlier this year, for nine straight days, he was even denied his daily exercise time. Unlike other inmates, who can work eight hours a day in prison factories, his father is essentially confined to a damp and undersized cell of about 70 square feet, 24 hours a day.
So I got an expresso and a hot burrito!
Forumosan avatar
ChewDawg
Gravel Truck Driver (suìshí chē sījī)
Gravel Truck Driver (suìshí chē sījī)
 
Posts: 1381
ORIGINAL POSTER
Joined: 06 Sep 2011, 10:27
112 Recommends(s)
96 Recognized(s)



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby Taigottawanna » 12 Mar 2012, 08:51

He's now a ward of the state, so his health is their responsibility. His previously inactive lifestyle can't be used as a justification. If he and his family did indeed ask for time out of his cell to exercise and work, I can't see the prison going, "no, because we don't think he took the time to exercise while president, therefore we will deny your request." And if he was given Ativan to "calm him down" without his knowledge or consent, that's pretty serious. I don't know, I'm not privy to the rationale for dosing him with a tranquilizer...maybe he was making a big ruckus and writing disparaging letters to the media.

I once read in a newspaper about an old guy in the US purposely getting himself arrested for shoplifting because the figured if he got thrown into the prison system, the state would give him free health coverage and he would no longer be a burden to his children (I think he had a health condition and not insurance). It being reported in the news, I reckon the judge and social services worked something out where he'd get decent health coverage without having to spend time in jail. I guess the old guy didn't know that being in prison exposes you to anal raping as well as free health insurance.
Forumosan avatar
Taigottawanna
English Teacher with Headband (bǎng tóujīn de Yīngwén lǎoshī)
English Teacher with Headband (bǎng tóujīn de Yīngwén lǎoshī)
 
Posts: 156
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 09:17
5 Recommends(s)
3 Recognized(s)



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby TheGingerMan » 12 Mar 2012, 10:27

"Chen, who is serving a 17-and-a-half-year prison sentence for corruption, was granted a temporary release from Taipei Prison on Tuesday for a medical checkup at Taoyuan General Hospital."


Was it his family that requested Taoyuan General Hospital, or have the authorities decided to punish him by sending him to what just might be the WORST possible health institution in the entire country?
:ponder:
"Turne ye to the strong hold, ye prisoners of hope,
even to day do I declare that I will render double unto thee:"

~~~ZECHARIAH 9:12

"Or fill high hawkfell of my hand,
with skalds reward for skilled word?"

~~~Egill Skallagrimssøn, c.974


"Opinion is underrated since it is too difficult for most and not understood by the rest."
~~~elektronisk
Forumosan avatar
TheGingerMan
Bureaucrat of the Underworld (cóng dìyù lái de guānliáo)
Bureaucrat of the Underworld (cóng dìyù lái de guānliáo)
 
Posts: 7807
Joined: 29 Aug 2005, 00:38
Location: The Thin Edge Of The Wedge
4 Recommends(s)
246 Recognized(s)
In Taiwan since: 0- 0-2114
Gruntleness: Fully Disgruntled



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby CraigTPE » 12 Mar 2012, 10:57

ChewDawg wrote:Hard time is exactly that---hard time. To me, there has been a repetitive pattern with Chen and his wife to use their ailments to get special conditions. If you do the crime, you should do the time no matter what your ailments are.

Yeah, interesting, huh. In the US, it wouldn't matter a damn. Can't do the time, don't do the crime.

Taigottawanna wrote:He's now a ward of the state, so his health is their responsibility. His previously inactive lifestyle can't be used as a justification. If he and his family did indeed ask for time out of his cell to exercise and work, I can't see the prison going, "no, because we don't think he took the time to exercise while president, therefore we will deny your request." And if he was given Ativan to "calm him down" without his knowledge or consent, that's pretty serious. I don't know, I'm not privy to the rationale for dosing him with a tranquilizer...maybe he was making a big ruckus and writing disparaging letters to the media.

I once read in a newspaper about an old guy in the US purposely getting himself arrested for shoplifting because the figured if he got thrown into the prison system, the state would give him free health coverage and he would no longer be a burden to his children (I think he had a health condition and not insurance). It being reported in the news, I reckon the judge and social services worked something out where he'd get decent health coverage without having to spend time in jail. I guess the old guy didn't know that being in prison exposes you to anal raping as well as free health insurance.

Never heard anyone describe prison health care as "decent".
Forumosan avatar
CraigTPE
Lost Winning Lotto Ticket (zhòngjiǎng cǎiquàn nòngdiū le)
Lost Winning Lotto Ticket (zhòngjiǎng cǎiquàn nòngdiū le)
 
Posts: 2942
Joined: 15 Jan 2008, 17:12
91 Recommends(s)
34 Recognized(s)



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby urodacus » 12 Mar 2012, 11:11

Perhaps A-Bian has abdominal bleeding?

Or is that just a wild shot?


I should stop, these comments make me sick to the stomach.
The prizes are a bottle of f*!@#$% SCOTCH and a box of cheap f!@#$#$ CIGARS!

Too many people! Almost all of the world's problems are due to overpopulation. The rest are due to religion.

50% of the world's wild animals have disappeared in the last 50 years. Did you eat them, or eat their house?
Forumosan avatar
urodacus
Maitreya Buddha (Mílèfó)
 
Posts: 11578
Joined: 04 Nov 2004, 23:20
Location: picking flowers
226 Recommends(s)
279 Recognized(s)



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby finley » 12 Mar 2012, 11:15

urodacus wrote:Perhaps A-Bian has abdominal bleeding?

Or is that just a wild shot?

I should stop, these comments make me sick to the stomach.


I had to think about that for a couple of seconds. More please :)
"Global warming is happening and we KNOW that man is 100 percent responsible!!!"
- Fred Smith
Forumosan avatar
finley
Thinking of Staging a Coup (xiǎng yào gǎo zhèng biàn)
Thinking of Staging a Coup (xiǎng yào gǎo zhèng biàn)
 
Posts: 6182
Joined: 20 Jan 2011, 23:34
926 Recommends(s)
688 Recognized(s)



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby CraigTPE » 12 Mar 2012, 11:16

TheGingerMan wrote:Was it his family that requested Taoyuan General Hospital, or have the authorities decided to punish him by sending him to what just might be the WORST possible health institution in the entire country? :ponder:

Should the prison system be required to use the BEST possible health institution? I imagine most will opt for the cheapest. Save tax dollars, you know.
Forumosan avatar
CraigTPE
Lost Winning Lotto Ticket (zhòngjiǎng cǎiquàn nòngdiū le)
Lost Winning Lotto Ticket (zhòngjiǎng cǎiquàn nòngdiū le)
 
Posts: 2942
Joined: 15 Jan 2008, 17:12
91 Recommends(s)
34 Recognized(s)



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby ChewDawg » 12 Mar 2012, 11:46

CraigTPE wrote:
TheGingerMan wrote:Was it his family that requested Taoyuan General Hospital, or have the authorities decided to punish him by sending him to what just might be the WORST possible health institution in the entire country? :ponder:

Should the prison system be required to use the BEST possible health institution? I imagine most will opt for the cheapest. Save tax dollars, you know.


He got access to medical resources that in some developed countries might take months on a waiting list. That's sort of why I am entertained by people complaining about his conditions. Ok, they should have taken him in sooner. But exercise within a jail can take place anywhere. I don't think his human rights are being violated.

The tests he received---much better than many inmates get in many countries.

Earlier Wednesday, Chen received a comprehensive medical examination including a colonoscopy, prostate ultrasound, abdominal ultrasound, two thallium-201 SPECT imaging tests, vision and intra-ocular pressure exams, and an electrocardiogram.
So I got an expresso and a hot burrito!
Forumosan avatar
ChewDawg
Gravel Truck Driver (suìshí chē sījī)
Gravel Truck Driver (suìshí chē sījī)
 
Posts: 1381
ORIGINAL POSTER
Joined: 06 Sep 2011, 10:27
112 Recommends(s)
96 Recognized(s)



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby Belgian Pie » 12 Mar 2012, 12:14

No, in Taiwan anyone has access to these facilities, fast ...
Belgian Pie
Maitreya Buddha (Mílèfó)
 
Posts: 11370
Joined: 31 Oct 2004, 19:39
Location: High ground
2 Recommends(s)
91 Recognized(s)



Re: A-Bian is sick

Postby Mucha Man » 12 Mar 2012, 13:32

Let's not get carried away with self-rightwingousness.

Chen is not a hardened violent criminal. He was charged with a couple economic crimes, the more serious crimes of embezzling state funds being long dropped.

In the US he would be in a comfy minimum security prison not in some supermax facility. :roll:
“Everywhere else in the world is also really old” said Prof. Liu, a renowned historian at Beijing University. “We always learn that China has 5000 years of cultural heritage, and that therefore we are very special. It appears that other places also have some of this heritage stuff. And are also old. Like, really old.”

http://hikingintaiwan.blogspot.com/
Forumosan avatar
Mucha Man
Guan Yin (Guānyīn)
 
Posts: 19003
Joined: 01 Nov 2001, 17:01
Location: Mucha, of course
887 Recognized(s)



FRIENDLY REMINDER
   Please remember that Forumosa is not responsible for the content that appears on the other side of links that Forumosans post on our forums. As a discussion website, we encourage open and frank debate. We have learned that the most effective way to address questionable claims or accusations on Forumosa is by engaging in a sincere and constructive conversation. To make this website work, we must all feel safe in expressing our opinions, this also means backing up any claims with hard facts, including links to other websites.
   Please also remember that one should not believe everything one reads on the Internet, particularly from websites whose content cannot be easily verified or substantiated. Use your common sense and do not hesitate to ask for proof.
Next




Proceed to Taiwan Politics



Who is online

Forumosans browsing this forum: No Forumosans and 2 visitors

Want to start off on the wrong foot with me? Put your carry-on in a full overhead bin, leave it sticking out six inches, then take your seat at the window and wait for someone else (me!) to come along and solve the physics problem you just created.
From "13 Things Your Flight Attendant Won't Tell You"